Sunderland 1 Arsenal 1: Frustrated by Wenger, frustrated by the FA
ONLY being really anti-social would have allowed me to watch the game live so I’m writing based only on reports and seeing the goals.
With respect to Sunderland, it is absurd that we should need to tear up the usual formation to face them. That Arsene feels ill at ease with Cesc and Denilson on their own in a game like this tells you everything about our lack of depth.
Denilson is not a terrible player, but I can’t think of a single attribute where he is better than Cesc.
That tells you that the pair really do not complement each other at all. Song at least sits deep in a way that does not come naturally to Cesc. Either way, Song and Denilson in central midfield is simply not good enough in any case if we’re honest.
And moving Cesc into an off the striker role, with RVP out left is one of those examples of Arsene being too clever. You could look at that formation pre-game and just know we were going to struggle. With Cesc our only top central midfielder, that simply has to be where he plays. After all, it is not as if we don’t have an abundance of attackers.
Also, Nasri should never be on the bench (unless injured). He is one of our best players and whereas as Robert Pires showed no inclination to ever track-back away from home, Nasri does. By dropping him, it is almost as if Arsene is telling him he expects him to struggle away from the Emirates. The absurd thing is that everything we have seen of Nasri thus far suggests he wouldn’t be bullied out of a game such as this. Very strange.
In the end, it finished 1-1.
We conceded another screamer before Cesc popped up with the kind of late goal William Gallas usually gets.
Moving on: we seriously, seriously need video replays. Everybody knows about the phantom goal in the Watford v Reading game a couple of weeks back, but if you actually think about it, it is just as outrageous we were denied the RVP goal when Theo was wrongly judged to have taken the ball out of play as he went to cross it for the Dutchman.
Of course, the error by the assistant referee was far easier to understand. But when the incident is pored over again and again using TV technology, surely the credibility of the game is undermined when we refuse to use the same technology to ensure greater fairness.
But it’s not just fairness. Refusal to use video replays also encourages cheats and helps them to prosper. I’m not holding up Nemanja Vidic as some great villain, but if we’re blunt what he did when he obstructed Jason Brown for United’s first goal at Ewood was a form of cheating. He made no attempt to get the ball and deliberately broke a rule of the game. A video replay would have sorted it out immediately.
Of course, there are many who say these things even themselves out over the course of a season. How, exactly?
I’m no great statistician but I have just carried out a brief experiment. I’ve put 32 red straws in a plastic bag and 32 green straws in the same plastic bag. The green straws represent a decision that goes in your favour, the red straws one that goes against you.
Without looking in the bag, I picked out 16 straws for Arsenal, 16 for Liverpool, 16 for Chelsea and the other 16 were for Man United. The reason for 16 is that I reckon on average each team is probably involved in that many highly contentious decisions a season that go the wrong way, whether it be incorrectly in their favour or wrongly against them.
If, as they say, it all evens itself at the end of the season, every team should have had eight red straws (eight fortunate decisions) and eight green straws (eight unfortunate decisions).
As it happens, Arsenal did get eight greens and eight reds. So we did balance out. Chelsea got nine good decisions and seven bad decisions, so no disaster there. But Liverpool got just five good decisions and a whopping 11 bad ones. All of which meant United got 10 good decisions and just six bad ones.
Were I a Liverpool fan, I wouldn’t be very happy.
You may think I should have better things to do with my life than pull straws from plastic bags and you’d probably be right.
But I do think I’ve made my point: these things are highly unlikely to even themselves out. So that is no excuse for not having video replays.
Anyway, we’re now four points behind Liverpool and Chelsea, who have both played United. It’s not a great start and it is frustrating because we seem to veer from the fairly woeful to the fairly sublime, with only the West Brom game somewhere in between.
5 October 2008 at 9:10 pm
A very tall viewpoint on things
5 October 2008 at 9:36 pm
Hahahah i hope you had fun.All these journo scum who says it even itselfes out dont know anything about football.And by the way it isnt about evening itself out over the season it is about getting it right the first time.Did the so called experts visit anfield in the cl when we played Pool………no.Did they go to the Emirates when Kuyt commited THAT penalty………did they bollocks.So they should shut up and let us have video technology.And i challenge you all to tell me when Manure were on the wrong side of a ref decision that cost them a cl semi final or 3 points ?????????
5 October 2008 at 9:41 pm
Good write-up, I largely concur.
5 October 2008 at 9:56 pm
how Nasri was left on the bench was beyond me. also a 4-5-1 formation is not good for a team such as ourselves. we never do well with 4-5-1 in games we have to win. doesn’t help when you have RVP on the left wing. I could see it was not working in the first half so why was he persisted with in that position for virtually the whole match? very frustrating watching that.
if wenger wants to stiffen the midfield then use a DM like Song with Cesc - that should be enough. If its not then everyone has to admit that we dont have good enough players. and if you dont have good enough players then you dont win trophies.
wenger as much admitted that he does not beleive we have the right players with his several bids for DMs in the summer. I wish Inler had come but doubt he will now. Losing Flamini will be the key reason why Arsenal will end up potless once again.
5 October 2008 at 10:22 pm
come off it guys after the lost against hull wenger said he would make changes to the team but did he?wenger dont care long as arsenal can get in the CL him and the board are happy. 4 the last 4years wenger keeps sayin hes got a young team so he can get away with it. did any one tel him he has to have a under 21s team? yes wenger wos one off the best thing 2 happen to arsenal but now hes truning into one off the worst thing that happend. when wenger first tok over at arsenal we wher a mid table team and after 12years it looks like we are whaer we stared off?
6 October 2008 at 12:31 am
That’s a really interesting experiment to illustrate the point about the inequality of chance outcomes over a relatively short number of instances. If you’d had the time & patience to add a nought to those figures (ie, 320 straws), things probably WOULD have evened themselves out better; similarly, over a long period of time (I’m talking years here), good and bad decisions probably would tend to even out for teams - but over a single season, they don’t necessarily do so. Last season is a perfect illustration. By my reckoning Arsenal were deprived of a near certain 4 points and a possible further 2 points in the weeks between late Feb and April 08:
1. Ref wrongly penalised Clichy for last-minute penalty at Birmingham (OK, Gael made a ludicrous mistake BUT he did recover to nick the ball away from the attacker just in time, only for the ref to give the pen anyway).
2. Ref wrongly denied Adebayor an early goal against Boro at the Emirates because he seemed not to know the offside law, as even Keith Hackett subsequently admitted (and probably allowed a Boro goal that SHOULD have been given offside, just to compound the misery for AFC fans).
3. Drogba’s equaliser at the Bridge was offside, but not given.
Maybe I’m biased, but I have thought hard about it and just cannot recall any points that Arsenal gained last season through iffy officiating.
Then remind yourself how many points behind the ‘champions’ Arsenal finished last season. Costly or what?
As far as I am concerned, those who refuse to consider the use of video technology in football are arguing for nothing less than the right of officals to get decisions wrong. WTF is all that about? We might as well just flip coins to find out which teams should ‘win’ matches.
6 October 2008 at 4:26 am
all wenger cares is for himself to win the CL nd then say goodbye to arsenal…that’s his goal .. for HIMSELF!
6 October 2008 at 5:56 am
I think the people who keep harping on the “it all evens out during the course of the season” don’t understand probabilities and that not all decisions are the same. A “wrong” decision in a tight game is not the same as a “proper” decision in a game where you’re doing well. As an example, United got a penalty against Bolton, and a clear obstruction that led to a goal in Blackburn–you could argue that they might have won both games but then again these are the sorts of decisions that “smaller’ (no disrespect meant here) teams struggle to recover from. Who knows what might’ve happened in those games?
Similarly with our goal against Sunderland–tight game, we score a beauty and it’s denied by a linesman who can’t even see the ball since Walcott’s obstructing it. If the goal had stood Sunderland would have had to chase the game, which would’ve opened up more space for us to exploit. Again, you never know what might’ve happened but it’s better to get things right than say that “things will even out”. This is like people saying, It’ll work out in the end, something good will come out of this. Sometimes that doesn’t happen.
The objection against video replay is silly. So what if it holds up the game for a few minutes? We’ll ultimately have good decisions and matches will not be lost on human errors, which are inevitable. There’s also a way to limit the time lost by allowing managers to ask for only 2 referrals per game.
But, with Platini at the helm, do you think we’ll get video technology? Could the FA implement the technology on its own? I am not sure if this is possible.
6 October 2008 at 6:11 am
They clearly don’t even themselves out. Look at us and Man U in the last two weeks. Both of their opening goals shouldn’t have stood, while we were disallowed two opening goals (Ade’s header against Hull is debatable, but I saw no clear foul). We could have been 5 points better off had decisions gone our way.
However, we shouldn’t be putting ourselves in a position to complain about decisions when we’re playing Hull and Sunderland. If we can get 4 past Porto, 4 at Blackburn and 4 at Bolton, we shouldn’t be struggling against similar (or arguable weaker) opponents.
Wenger really annoyed me with that formation. It pained me to see Ade isolated, Cesc short of runners, and RVP lost and frustrated on the wing in Kiev, so as soon as I saw the teamsheet for Sunderland I expected a poor performance. Like Mike Bassett would say: Arsene, play 4-4-fucking-2.
6 October 2008 at 6:12 am
3 at Bolton*
6 October 2008 at 7:08 am
I really cannot understand the decision to leave Nasri on the bench. We now have a 2 week break due to internationals, but Nasri has not been selected for the French side so it’s not as if Wenger needed to rest him.
6 October 2008 at 10:06 am
Living in Scotland, I don’t get to attend many Arsenal games. This was the first I had attended since the 1-1 friendly at Celtic five years ago — before that it was Notts County away in the FA Cup in 1977 (I think). This trip was a birthday present, so I was really looking forward to this game, despite having to sit amongst the Sunderland fans.
First up, the Arsenal fans were just terrific — they sang all the way through and seemed to have some friendly rivalry with the neighbouring Sunderland fans. A good atmosphere.
It is easy to forget that watching games on TV doesn’t show you everything and MotD later showed hardly anything that I saw. So here are my thoughts, in no particular order:
1. Most of the 1st half was played in Sunderland’s end of the pitch. I almost got a crick in the neck.
2. Arsenal’s defence looked well organised. Kolo was noticeably vocal. Cisse (or “Cissy” as one vocable Mackem called him) was of little threat.
3. Van Persie’s goal was coming as we had all the momentum after the break. Had it stood, it would have been a different match entirely.
4. The weather was awful, the pitch was really wet and the wind was whipping the ball around. In the second half the ball was on the deck more and that helped.
5. Both teams played with a high line that made midfield congested. Arsenal looked too narrow. vP and Walcott kept drifting in. Meanwhile, Ade drifted wide. On more than one occasion Ade was crossing high balls from the right to Walcott in the centre. What’s wrong with that picture? Needless to say it didn’t work.
6. Almunia looked a safe pair of hands. Clichy (especially) and Sagna were amazing. There were some moments of sweetness from Cesc and smart defending from Gallas and Toure too. I was watching out for Denilson and Song. Denilson was involved in a lot of link-up play, particularly at the back and offering an option when looking to switch wings. He looked less comfortable going forward, as if he couldn’t see the angles or passes. Yes, things do break down with Denilson, but on Saturday he had the ball at least as much as Cesc. To be more effective in his position, he needs to play more simply. Song looked much more solid (he’s a big guy!) and would carry the ball forward and play the simple pass. He could also throw dummies to give himself space in a way that Cesc does in a more forward position. Theo had a day when things didn’t work for him and we didn’t see much of his pace. He was allowed no room and was often quickly closed down. When Gallas roamed forward, Song covered in defence. In truth, the unexpected extra man up front did seem to make a difference. In a 4-5-1 you need your target man to stay up, but Ade also kept coming deep, adding to midfield congestion.
7. When the subs came on, the shape seemed to remain the same. That meant that Nasri (for Walcott) also played on the RHS and drifted inside. He had two chances, but maybe they fell to his weaker foot. Things happen around Bentner in a way that they don’t with other players. He worked noticeably hard, drew defenders, created space and released team mates. Didn’t see much of Vela, sadly.
8. After an hour, the game opened up and it was more end to end. However, we didn’t get into top gear until they scored, when it became cup final stuff. Then after equalising, we had a decent stab at getting a winner. Why didn’t this happen earlier in the game? But, I was there when Arsenal scored from a corner. And Cesc with his head. How he got it I don’t know.
9. Richardson and Reid were the best Sunderland players. Reid might look like a Sunday league player, but he read the game well and could quickly break things up and create something. When Denilson (I think) was caught in possession in the build up for the goal, this wasn’t the first time in the game that it had happened to an Arsenal player. Expect other teams to pressure the midfield in this way.
10. The Sunderland fans sang “You’re shit scared of Roy Keane”, but really either set of fans could have sung that song.
Our current side look very good indeed and it was a privilege to watch them play. They were let down though by their shape and some decision-making against a focused and defensively well-organised side. I like what Wenger is doing, but I doubt that wiser heads would have had the same problem. I hope that the side can learn from this recent experience.
6 October 2008 at 11:40 am
@Gogsy
good to see somebody living in the same part of the country as me (Edinburgh) cheering for the gunners. I couldn’t watch the game on Saturday because of work, but read so many people claiming AW’s head…How nice to read the positives from somebody who actually was there!!
Many thanks!
6 October 2008 at 4:34 pm
I too actually got to see the game now I am in the North East after two decades living in France. I concur wholeheartedly with Gogsy’s analysis. The weather was atrocious in the first half and it killed the game as a spectacle. What got to me was that the system and team selection were clearly not working and Arsene just did nothing until it was too late. And if we had shown half the urgency we did in the final 10 minutes we would have won at a canter.
6 October 2008 at 5:15 pm
@ScotGoon
I’m glad to know I’m not alone and am not the only one who missed the Porto game because STV (ITV1) showed Celtic and ITV4 Man U. Not for the first time either…
Personally, I can’t stand all the negative talk. Clearly, Wenger tried to buy some people in the summer, it didn’t come off for whatever reason, so we have to go with what we’ve got. No need to slag them. The team look good, but they need to step up a gear, like they did at the end of the Sunderland game. Only earlier please, next time.
@ Strip Tees
Agree, that the changes were too late to win the game, but before their goal we were still getting chances and half chances. Maybe Wenger thought the breakthrough was going to happen before their goal came from the blue.
Incidentally, it was good to learn in the papers about Leadbitter’s background and why he was kissing the turf in front of their dugout while Keane patted his head. From where I was sitting it looked like the whole team was kissing Roy Keane’s feet and he was blessing them (!)
6 October 2008 at 6:23 pm
Pretty good call Gogsy.
I was there too. The wings were almost unplayable in the 1st half & Sunderland dug in even more in the 2nd half.
This was nowhere near as bad a performance as it has been portrayed.
If you didn’t see the game there is very little point in making such a high & mighty post, Goodplaya. You let yourself down.
6 October 2008 at 6:58 pm
Would’nt argue with any of what you wrote GP, at least now (all of early October) we won’t have to listen to Wenger deluding us with “i believe that we have the quality to challenge for league/CL/fa cup/ladies challenge cup…”. Because lets face it not even the most optimistic Gooner ever believed that in a million years. This season was all horribly predictable without new blood needed thro the spine of the team. Good to see Gooners from Scotland and up north, could’nt believe the different accents in Milan last season, we’ll have to stop ripping Man Ure at this rate..
6 October 2008 at 8:41 pm
Gogsy thanks for the review some really interesting points. I was on holiday so managed to miss both the Hull game and the Sunderland game. I caught Porto on the TV though, but was wondering what happened up North - much appreciated.
Strangely I also missed West Ham game where we lost to them as well.
8 October 2008 at 6:19 am
couldn’t agree more..
arsene till today doesnt really realise the mistakes he’d done by placing players out of position.
simple rule of thumb: players perform best in their best position. dduh
i hope he doesnt do it again in the next competitive game. especially the league games.
but then again, knowing wenger.. who knows?
8 October 2008 at 12:29 pm
aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaarsenal
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28 November 2009 at 3:16 pm
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5 February 2010 at 10:48 pm
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