Arsenal 0 Fener 0: Ramsey sets example to others - report + ratings
Playa Ratings
21 - Fabianski, 7
22 - Clichy, 6.5
5 - Toure, 6.5
20 - Djourou, 7
18 - Silvestre, 7
15 - Denilson, 7
4 - Cesc, 5.5
8 - Nasri, 6
16 - Ramsey, 7.5
11 - van Persie, 7.5
26 - Bendtner, 5.5
12 - Vela [Sub], 6.5
2 - Diaby [Sub], 5.5
17 - Song [Sub], 6.5
THIS was your classic instantly forgettable Champions League stalemate where the away side comes for the draw and the home side lacks the nous to break them down.
On another night this could have gone the way of Porto.
That night we hit back following defeat to a promoted side despite a nervy start. But whereas the first half goals came and relaxed us on that night, against Fenerbahce that little luck we needed was not there.
First RVP saw a point blank range shot deflected over the bar by a defender who knew little about it. Then the bar intervened after he had opened things up with a delicious turn.
It was a decentish first half, with RVP and the impressive Aaron Ramsey at the heart of much of our best work. Ramsey was busy and neat and always wanted the ball, often straying from his berth on the right of midfield to collect it deep in semi Fabregassian fashion.
There were frustrating performances too. Cesc was rubbish, Nasri probably had his worst game for the club (admittedly not saying much) and Bendtner was anonymous.
Fenerbahce were completely unadventurous, so much so that not even our notoriously porous defence, which had Fabianski in goal, ever really looked like conceding. Yup, they were that defensive.
We lacked confidence and as time wore on it became more and more of an issue. We are a team that play so much of our best stuff on instinct and yet we had none. Without it, we were lost. Every pass was thought over far, far too much.
Ramsey was slightly harshly subbed just after the hour basically for being young (though he had flagged after the break). Bendtner’s removal was more understandable. I think it’s fair to say that while some players simply lost their touch and confidence (Cesc and Nasri and to an extent the slightly more cautious than usual Clichy), others could do with a bit more of Ramsey’s get up and go attitude.
Bendtner hardly went out of his way to make things happen and nor did Ramsey’s replacement, the passive Abou Diaby. In fairness to Denilson, his application could not really be faulted, even if the fear remains that a lack of quality next to him is contributing to his poor form.
A word about Kolo. The ease with which Arsene removes him from the middle and dispatches him to right-back says a lot about his faith in our central defence.
The result was hardly ideal preparation for United but equally these kind of games are part and parcel of playing football.
And as I tried to say last week it’s not the end of the world unless you make it the end of the world. Unfortunately, we tend to do that.
So, a frustrating night, but they happen to all teams.
Three other points:
1) Any prospect of RVP apologising to the fans for his sending-off? I know it’s only words, but as a fan who has forked out so much money for a season ticket, it irks me a lot that we’re going to be so light up front for United at home. Adebayor and Eduardo are injured, which is fair enough. RVP was just bloody stupid.
2) Given nobody else dares say it, I’ll say it: Steven Gerrard dived on Tuesday night.
3) Tony Pulis: You had every right to defend yourself (and in my mind were quite right to) against Arsene’s claims of brutality by Stoke on Saturday. But at the end of your statement you said:
“I and my Football Club have tremendous respect for Mr Wenger and Arsenal Football Club, but as Mr Wenger is such a learned professional and on a great day in American electoral history, I would like to remind him of Abraham Lincoln’s great quotation, “You can fool some of the people all of the time, and all of the people some of the time, but you can not fool all of the people all of the time.”"
Hilarious. Not.
Maybe it’s just me, but if that’s not a man taking the piss, I don’t know what is.
And whatever gripes one may have with Arsene, taking the piss out of the man just ain’t on.
Pulis would do well to remember where Stoke go on the final day of the season. And he’d do well not to expect any favours.
6 November 2008 at 10:05 am
I was at the game and saw it exactly the same. They are totally lacking belief and confidence - there was no insticntive one touch passing.
Considering he now has a big chance to get some games under his belt Bendtner was awful, he should have been in the box trying to get on the end of things instead of constantly over-lapping Clichy.
Ramsey should not have been taken off. It was what I would call an ‘international’ substitution where the youngest player gets subbed because he will get upset the least.
Anybody know if Almunia was injured?
6 November 2008 at 10:20 am
Why Arsenal could not win:
- they were so carefull ,may fear to lose instead of what they good at fast pass ball and their tendency to make goal
- RVP was spent too much chances to make goal
- the team work actions is not as good as the first choice players such as there are Ade,RVP,Wallcot, Nasri sure Fabregas. . . as when they shown in the starting seasons games.
- Ramsy is the very good player,but still 17 and so his action is still a bit slow for the team work.
the rotation is needed but be carefull with situation of which game?
Arsenal had improved to the best their striking performent comparing to last year, the defend still got problems.
6 November 2008 at 10:26 am
On a positive note, I thought Djourou and Denilson were really good.
Denilson did his job well, siting behind Cesc while still reamining mobile, put in some good tackles and broke up a lot of Fenerbache’s play. And Djourou did a solid job at CB, attacking the ball in the air in a way we’ve been desperate for. Djourou seems to be an ACTIVE defender in that he actively seeks out to defend rather than the passive style of defending most of our other CBs employ.
Wenger seems to rate Song above Djourou, but I’d really like to see Djourou have a bigger role in the team. He certainly deserves a chance at least.
6 November 2008 at 10:37 am
I too was at the game last night and again in agreeing with the other comments, have a few more to add. These are the main points that struck me last night;
1. We have no pace. The speed at which we attacked was so pedestrian that Fenerbahce had time to get 8 yellow shirst behind the ball…every time - with the exception of a 4 on 3 that was snuffed out by a poor Vela pass. Remember the days when Match of the Day would put a stop watch in the corner of the screen to show the speed at which we counter attacked from defending a corner to scoring at the other end?
2. Without Walcott starting (all pray he is fit for the weekend), our ‘wingers’ are so very one dimensional. Every time a wide player got the ball, they turned inside and looked for a short pass. Only once did I see Nasri try to take his man on the outside, and even then he was easily tackled.
3. Static play. Without the pace that I mentioned previously, any recipient of a pass was either square, or slightly behind the play. There was no intelligent movement, creating the space and angles that Cesc so badly needs to invigorate his game.
4. The prospect of Bendtner leading our line for the Man U game makes me shudder. I’m wondering whether Mr Wenger may well deploy Walcott up front and play Diaby on the left, switching Nasri to the right. He may even go 4-5-1 with Bendtner alone up front and Diaby just behind. We’ll see I guess.
6 November 2008 at 10:40 am
Oh, and I forgot point 5 - Denilson had a great game. If only he could lean forward a little into his shots and get his knee over the ball!
6 November 2008 at 11:27 am
I think Diaby will be used behind Bendtner on saturday. Nasri left, walcott right, Den and Cesc middle, both sagna and Gallas will return and I would think Djourou be dropped. Unlucky Johan, you cant play any better than you did last night or have done every time this season - wenger just has his favourites.
6 November 2008 at 11:31 am
Djourou was great, he won the high balls (something we lacked this season) he didnt pull back from challenges! I think he should be in the 1st team more often.
Am i the only 1 who thinks Toure will be great as our defensive midfielder??? He’s mobile, quick and strong! He’s also a good going forwad! With Walcott, Cesc, Toure and Nasri, our midfield will be great!
To TopGunPires, Almunia was dropped because he had a stomach bug!
6 November 2008 at 11:59 am
A bit generous on Fabianski who showed potentially fatal indecision not coming for an easy ball when Fene had a break - and anyone who complains about Almunia punching rather than catching should not be calling for Fabianski to replace him!
Also harsh on Diaby who was responsible (with Clichy) for the only signs of life in H2
Big Johan was of course excellent, despite lack of menace from Fene. (Amused to see the great Colin Kazim Richards has metamorphosed into Kazim Kazim, even if his shirt hasnt caught up)
6 November 2008 at 12:03 pm
Please! Toure does not have the control for midfield - maybe 3/4 years ago but he has become big and clumsy, and error prone - both physically and worse of all, mentally - I’m afraid.
He did OK last night but he did not have anything to do much except attack.
He wears red and white so I love him dearly and was awesome when I saw him a few times early on down at Barnet - an absolute physical specimen who just ate up the ground with his pace. But his best days are looking in the past I’m afraid because I think he has been too long in the doldrums - 18 mths since the Lge Cup Final.
So, sorry centre back is the best way we can use Kolo but one way or another we need to find a combination at the back - we think maybe something works then it goes bad again. Maybe Kolo will not be part of a combination - we shall see.
I don’t want to hammer Kolo but the bottom line is that he has become ordinary and frankly being captain is amazing because he is not necessarily a shoe-in for the team - but who is I hear you ask? Well that is true and probalbly indicates why we have become somewhat ordinary.
I’ll be nervous for sure on saturday but maybe we can get a bit of luck which is often the difference in sport. Look at Liverpool!!
6 November 2008 at 12:20 pm
Djourou is a possibility for midfield. whenever he is asked his best position in interviews he still says central midfield. I remember a certain M flamini saying the same thing and we all thought he’s got no chance. we all thought he was a back up left back, then he goes and proves us all wrong. Djourou has wonderfull ball control, does all the little drag backs and clearly is massive as well. maybe wenger thinks he is too big for central midfield but I think for tough away games you need someone like that in there.
6 November 2008 at 12:25 pm
I am his biggest fan - obviously - but i do think Djourou looks very skilful for a CB, but is too big for midfield - he just says he thinks he’s a midfielder because it’s a sexier position - he is ideal for CB - but we must give him an extended run to see if he is now mature and consistent enough….
6 November 2008 at 1:36 pm
I thought Denilson had a really good game, especially on the defensive side. One tackle was Flamini-esque in a bull-dog nipping at your heels kind of way.
I hope Walcott will be fit for Man U because then the 4-5-1 with Diaby playing the man behind the striker, gulp, Bendtner, wouldn’t be so bad. Yes, RvP certainly needs to apologize for his boneheaded head butt–if he were on the pitch against United, you can bet your ass that Ferdinand and Vidic wouldn’t be happy. As it is, they must be thrilled that they’re not playing him.
The other thing is that United will not play as negative as Fenerbache did, so we will get more space. As will they.
Any idea if Sagna’s back?
6 November 2008 at 1:41 pm
I think Pulis’s comment is fair enough - actually quite amused me. Wenger’s only fooling himself if he thinks that Stoke’s ‘intimidatory’ tactics were the cause of our defeat. The lack of effort from the players and the garbage team selection contributed far more to the outcome.
Wenger is also trying to fool the fans by pretending that we can win major trophies without proven experience and quality in the squad. Great to watch while we’re on song unfortunately when the chips are down there’s nowhere near enough character in the squad. It doesn’t hurt the likes of Adebayor, Song and Eboue when we lose because they’re only concerned about picking out their mates for a high five at the end of each game.
6 November 2008 at 2:47 pm
Putting disappointment over the last 3 games aside, for a number of years the end of October and begining of November has traditionally been a time for a dip in form and a string of poor results. The difference has always been how long the dip lasts, as to how that affects the rest of the season. We may have to grin and bear it for a couple of more games, before we come out of this rut. Perhaps, after playing so many weaker sides, whose primary intention is the defend and try to score on the break, it might be a relief to play a team that tries to attack as much or even more than it tries to defend. Maybe we will have a high scoring game on Saturday. Who knows, the Boys may surprise us.
6 November 2008 at 3:08 pm
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6 November 2008 at 4:00 pm
Good post GP. It was interesting watching Liverpool and Arsenal trying to break down a defensive team. The one difference was the Liverpool mixed it up a bit. One minute it would be short neat passes around the edge of the box, the next it was a big hoof into the middle. They just kept pulling the defense around the pitch. Arsenal on the other hand only use the one approach - the killer pass into the box. When you only play the one way, its easy to shut you down. We have no variation last night. A bouncing ball in the penalty are creates all sorts of trouble.
However, I would prefer to draw a game the way we did last night than to cheat a result the way Liverpool did. Than was the worst dive I have seen in years, up there with Pires, but no-one came out and criticised it. Pundits are scared to criticise British players. They all said it was controversial. No it wasn’t, it was a blatant f**king dive. Gerard cheated the referee.
6 November 2008 at 6:04 pm
Just a few quick thoughts on some of the talking points - Toure wouldn’t make a good CM for the reasons highlighted above, but I also think he lacks the necessary vision with the ball, he tends to be a bit head down and unaware (or slowly aware) of what is around him and I think that was the great thing about Gilberto, Flamini etc they could win the ball and knew what to do with it very quickly.
Regarding Denilson - his best game for us I thought. Diaby looks promising and deserving of a bit more time in the middle a serious contender to start up top in a 4-5-1 (am I really hoping for a 4-5-1 at Home?!?).
I thought Vela looked slow and off the pace last night - I’m hoping it was a result of the lethargy in the rest of the team at Half time.
Ramsey - if played on merit he would be getting much more time.
Overall - a draw was not a bad result - I was hoping for a win so we could rest the big guns and play the kids against Kiev but hey I gues they’ll have to wait until the Porto game…
6 November 2008 at 7:37 pm
Liverpool are dirty and very lucky! Gerrard clearly took a dive, that lines man had his head up his arse! It pissed me off, it reminded me of the way they knocked us out in last season’s CL!
Im happy with last nights performance, we defended well, they never looked like conceding a goal! I was disapointed with Bendtner, V.Persie was a lone striker, Bendtner wasnt in the game, at all! Ramsey impressed me last night, i think he can take on Fabregas’ role in the future, thats if Cesc decides to leave the club! Djourou was just excellent, he should be a permanent CB in our team! Toure, Silvestre and Gallas have been disapointing, so 2 of them have to be dropped for Djourou!
I dont see a reason to be afraid of ManU, i think we can beat them! My prediction is 2-0 to the Gunners!!!
6 November 2008 at 9:55 pm
Gibbs, where did you get that confidence from? I wish I was as sanguine as you are. My prediction is a 4-0 defeat to Man United and a long day at the boozer trying to forget.
7 November 2008 at 12:25 am
For all of you hoping Djourou will get a run in the team, weren’t we saying something similar at the start of the season and then as per norm Wenger kept with his favourites of Gallas and Toure. Gallas has actually impressed me this year (particularly against Tottenham and West Ham) unlike Toure, although he did play quite well yesterday, but let’s be honest, he had no defending to do.
Stevie Morrow is God, you could also see that Liverpool’s crossing was MUCH better than ours which is something we really have to improve on (although it would help if someone actually attacked the 6 yard area, then again that’s hard to do if the defenders hold a high line and your wingers can’t get past their markers).
7 November 2008 at 1:10 am
I really can’t see how Van Persie can be given a 7.5 considering his misses. Denilson for MOTM for me because of his heckling and persistence, and I’d give Fabianski 6.5 because of that time where he stayed on his line.
I’d just like to say that people should stop saying Denilson is a Cesc-clone (although you could say that Cesc played as a defensive midfielder when he was at Barca). He is and has always played as a defensive midfielder, he’s just good on the ball just like pretty much every Arsenal player has to be (sometimes seems a bad thing when it comes to centre backs). His only problem is that he’s a little short which is problematic when dealing with set pieces but apart from that he has great qualities to be a very good defensive midfielder for someone aged just 20.
7 November 2008 at 8:36 am
Fabregas’ Dad,
I agree with you about Denilson. He’s not getting the credit he deserves, and people seem intent on analyzing his performances based on their ideas of him rather than his actual performances.
And even though his height seems like it could cause problems, Denilson has actually been one of our best players at defending set pieces. So far this year, Gallas, Toure and Diaby have all caused us to concede goals because of their inabilty to defend set pieces. Then consider that Denilson has surprisingly quite often been given the job of marking some of the oppositions biggest or best headers of the ball(I particularly remember this against West Brom, Blackburn and Bolton). Agaginst West Brom he marked Ishmael Miller, who Gallas was barely able to cope with in open play. And while I don’t know their names, I’ve noticed that he has many times been given the job of marking big opposition during set pieces. I noticed it early on because I remember wondering why the hell Denilson was the one assigned to marking them.
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